One reoccurring article in the press worldwide
is the allure of the possibility of purchasing a French chateau
and the lifestyle associated with it.
is the allure of the possibility of purchasing a French chateau
and the lifestyle associated with it.
There was an escapist real estate feature last week in the Telegraph showing a classically proportioned French chateau that was the same price as a three bedroom flat in Mayfair.
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Trafalgar Square is only one hectacre.
This chateau in France has the usual grand features
such as a grand staircase
such as a grand staircase
and an ornate jib door leading somewhere interesting.
Of course a private chapel is de rigueur darlings.
Sin and saintliness were private affairs - very pre Hello magazine.
Although a private stage less so.
But it is so Cecil Beaton weekend away don't you think?
But it is so Cecil Beaton weekend away don't you think?
But just a few days ago in social media news on the
Candian version of Buzzfeed they featured a comparison of what you could get in France versus what you could get in Vancouver.
Candian version of Buzzfeed they featured a comparison of what you could get in France versus what you could get in Vancouver.
They compared a 27 acre estate with 9 bedrooms, 5 bathrooms
and stables to a similar priced 2 bed 2 bath flat below
that boasted a "European" kitchen.
CAD $1.38 million if you're asking.
and stables to a similar priced 2 bed 2 bath flat below
that boasted a "European" kitchen.
A few months ago, I had also seen in the Australian media
a big article comparing French chateaus being cheaper than flats in Sydney.
and the 3 bedroom unit in Campsie, Sydney below
are both asking for A$ 680,000.
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1960's red brick work on an ugly modern building was explicit enough to shock any Australian.
It seems the benchmark that house prices have gone crazy is that the median price of many homes in the first world has overtaken the cost of a chateau!
This was obviously not exclusive to the UK mentality which is obsessed with home ownership and house prices.
I have a feeling it is seeped in Anglo-Saxon roots
therefore any country that speaks English as its main language
will share this affliction.
Even when the inside decor pics aren't 100% perfect,
it is still an escapist setting.
It seems many people lose the same financial senses and logistical faculties especially when they go overseas to purchase their holiday home/retirement home.
All the tough questioning that would normally through their head when buying a new dress seems to dissipate in a foreign country buying a home!
( It could be all that rose wine.)
But there are political and economic reasons to remember why property is cheap.
French politics tend to be erratic but taxes are a constant.
New levies are introduced depending on the president elect.
Property outside Paris is notoriously hard to sell.
French politics tend to be erratic but taxes are a constant.
New levies are introduced depending on the president elect.
Property outside Paris is notoriously hard to sell.
I have seen some houses that are still for sale 4 years on!
People looking for a Georgian rectory in the U.K. would be lucky to see more than a dozen for sale in the Costwolds. It would be a quick viewing to see affordable studios in a city like Sydney or Toronto and yet there is plenty of stock of French chateaus.
There is even more for sale once you get to France that are not listed on the websites.
The bigger the chateau the cheaper it is too!
Well I am being a bit facetious but running costs are not to be ignored.
Many homes don't have central heating or plumbing
and to install these basic amenities will require patience for bureaucracy and red tape, money, and some more patience.
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So do be cautious about a restoration project in France.
Bureaucracy in France is not to be underestimated and
that is even if you are fluent in French.
Of course I think a home in France would be enjoyable if done right but I think there are not as many articles about being careful and raising concern as there are in promoting the idea of the idyllic French country life.
What doesn't get publicized as often is those who tire of the lifestyle or need to balance out their life in France with another base in a city or even another country. Life isn't all about drinking the latest released wines by the pool and shopping at the different antique markets at a different village every day of the week.
There are many stories about village disputes,
some xenophobic council members being a pest,
and lonely winters in empty hamlets that are quickly forgotten about in the lavender scented l'heure bleue pastis induced haze.
What doesn't get publicized as often is those who tire of the lifestyle or need to balance out their life in France with another base in a city or even another country. Life isn't all about drinking the latest released wines by the pool and shopping at the different antique markets at a different village every day of the week.
There are many stories about village disputes,
some xenophobic council members being a pest,
and lonely winters in empty hamlets that are quickly forgotten about in the lavender scented l'heure bleue pastis induced haze.
One day I may consider the option myself but
I would consider many aspects of a move and
not be bamboozled by false house price comparisons and someone's travel account of the fabulous time they had when they were in Provence for two weeks a few years ago!
I would consider many aspects of a move and
not be bamboozled by false house price comparisons and someone's travel account of the fabulous time they had when they were in Provence for two weeks a few years ago!
There is a show here called Selling Houses Abroad about the nightmare of buying in Spain/Portugal/France and then having to sell in a slow market. I love the idea of it but I know the reality would be challenging. Real estate prices where I live are insane. I don't know how people manage!
ReplyDeleteLove to you and your straw bag thinking that I luff. x
It seems in many European countries seling houses taking years is rather normal! But who wants to get stuck like that? Plus the weather is not good year round so even though rents could be expensive it might be worth it when you consider the cost over years. Straw bag says send her love too hehe x
Deletei could drink that koolaid, don't interject reality, not yet! but probably timely as i head to france next month
ReplyDeletedebra
It's too easy to drink!! September in France is one of the best months!!! Just don't sign anything ok???
DeleteSo true, Naomi!
ReplyDeleteDon't we all daydream about a house in France? Even just a lovely rustic bastide in Provence, or maybe an apartment in Paris. Not necessarily a grand chateau. I know I do. But yes, so many hidden extras beyond the basic cost. And the bureaucracy and local politics and keeping the mayor and all his cousins and nephews onside etc are all deterrents too. Know a few Aussies who bought houses in rural France and flew over for a few months each year. They snapped them up at incredibly cheap prices, especially the ones in or near isolated villages. But after a few years and dollars slipping away on new boilers, heating systems etc -and tiring of being tied to the one place, last I heard most were trying to sell.
When we were in Provence in May we saw so many houses for sale in small villages, in the Luberon, for example. These places are very cold and pretty much dead in the winter. Even the locals try to get away. Though gorgeous during the summer when there are cherries on the trees and fields scarlet with poppies or later purple with lavender. No wonder we all get tempted, specially over a rose on a terrace in late spring. But for us it's just a pleasant daydream and will never become a reality.
Much more viable though if you live in England - so much more accessible, So interested to hear it might possibly be on the cards for you in the future some time. Pammie xxx
It's a London thing to check house websites in Provence every few months!! That's why I see certain houses for sale from years back and others have just given up. I would definitely buy if weather was year round but for 4 months a year don't know if I can be bothered. But I am weighing it all up. Ideally I prefer Italy but their government makes the French republic look so stable and moderate...I would love to live in Australia but Mr CSW doesn't fly and I have to say that flight is a feat in not only engineering but jetlag and physical strength xxx
DeleteLove Italy too! We used to spend holidays in Tuscany and dreamed of having a place there - but as you say, Italy makes France look stable. Even Frances Mayes had problems eventually when she objected to a pop-up club in her neighbourhood.
DeleteYes, the long haul flights are dreadful. I asked one of my grand-daughters what was the thing (if anything) she disliked about her fantastic holiday in France, Brussels, Holland, Germany, Austria and Hungary and she replied it was the long flights - she couldn't sleep. But I'm training her - I agreed with her but said "It's just one of those things you have to learn to tolerate. If you want to return to Europe you have to be prepared to accept the flights. Did you think it was worth it despite how much you hated the flights?" "Oh yes," was the reply! But if Mr CSW doesn't fly at all, then it's certainly not possible. Pammie xxx
My ideal would be Sicily. That is my favorite place in Italy and I adore everything about it. But alas that is also one of the most southern regions in Europe and would be a pain for Mr CSW to get there plus they have their own version of red tape there and rarely do people buy property there - it is inherited or received somehow! Yes if only there was no jetlag to recover from I would be over to Melbourne at least once a month!! xx
DeleteAdore Sicily too. So many wonderful places - particularly love Taormina, also Palermo (despite the mad chaotic traffic) - and the islands. But my hairdresser's family comes from Sicily and she said it's still difficult there. Her family members own farms (vineyards and olives) and live in old houses. They deliberately leave them to look very rundown and decrepit on the outside - but she said they're beautiful and have all mod cons on the inside. Apparently if the outside looks good they risk a knock on the door demanding money - from people they can't refuse. They also always tell everyone their farms are doing really badly - bad season etc. Dreadful to have to live like that. She was thinking of buying a place herself as a holiday house - but has changed her mind as apparently things are pretty depressed there with increasing unemployment and she was worried that property values would fall.
DeleteWhen we in a car on the way to Palermo from the airport we stopped in traffic for awhile still on the highway. As I looked around I saw a plaque that indicated we were at the actual spot where the anti-Mafia Judge Falcone, his wife, driver and bodyguard were blown up and killed on their way back to town from the airport. Have you read "Midnight in Sicily"? Really worth reading. Pammie xxx
I haven't read it but will as the area just captured me in every way. If it weren't for those problems I think I'd live there all year round. But alas the roots are quite deep. My friends and I stayed at a hotel in the west of Sicily and the local mayor and some businessmen had their weekly meeting for an hour in the pool- hard to record in the water. I had to tell my friend our game of Marco Polo would have to wait...there are some superb homes languishing in Sicily. But I don't know if I'm game! X
DeleteSunday brunch at our hotel in Palermo turned out to be very interesting.
DeleteAfter a minute or two I noticed two men sitting at a smallish table of honour where they could survey the room and also those who entered and left. The older one was exquisitely dressed in light creams and greys with a beautiful tie and a magnificent borsalino on the chair next to him. The other was muscular and lean, in well worn jeans and jean jacket, with a craggy hard face and was tense and very alert, constantly surveying the room - one hand in his pocket. The bodyguard. As we watched, the locals came up individually and kissed the hand of the man with the borsalino. The fathers with small children presented them to him and he'd pat them on the head. There was much respect being shown - to the local godfather. Fascinating and chilling at the same time. We seemed to be the only foreigners there (discovered later they mostly put overseas visitors in another room). Pammie
Odd thing about the west of sicily is that like Tokyo - when the mafia is strong there is no petty crime!
DeleteI would love to stay in a French chateau for a week or so but not permanently. Make my chateau a townhouse on the Upper East Side of Manhattan and now you're talking! Housing prices are crazy here too, in Brooklyn. I bet a brownstone here is more expensive than some of those lovely chateaus, which seems wrong! xx
ReplyDeleteYes I need to do a costing in the long term but did you see the piece on the NYT last week about how a couple gave up looking in Brooklyn and went back to Manhattan and found something cheaper! I think everyone just stopped looking in Manhattan so ironically there is less competition there now!! xx
DeleteSo funny Naomi! The rose is the kool-aid for sure, when in Provence and while driving by all of those for sale signs outside charming crumbling houses, oh the fantasy of owning a house in France. I know a couple here who do own one and are there 8 months of the year, he's a contractor though and apparently does all of the fixing himself. Their home here is quite modest, and easy to care for so they can just lock the door and go.
ReplyDeleteWe've been through this thought process with the concept of owning a vacation property and the thing is it is much easier to rent and there are always places available. Then there isn't any fixing or dealing with all of the commotion of ownership, I already own another building besides our home (our office building) and even though it's a good investment it's a pain in the butt.
Love the pics and one thing is certain: home and condo prices are certainly inflated just now in some places! XO
I am conflicted because I love revisiting a place and I love going back to places that are new and yet familiar but I think in the long run if you like adventure the same place over a decade might be too much an as you say maintenance issues are just so boring. Do I really want sets of electricity bills? But then again I change my mind so often on this topic!! xx
DeleteI actually have a friend whose family inherited a big chateau in France and I had the opportunity spend several weekends there many years ago. It was drafty and musty. The hot water was almost non-existent. The closest food stores were quite far away down bumpy muddy roads. There were mice. But it was beautiful and fun and romantic and the grounds were fabulous and over-grown. In the end it was just too much money and up keep for the family and they eventually sold it. It is now a boys' school. I guess they don't mind a cold bath.
ReplyDeleteYes they do end up institutions or empty. Oddly the French don't have the same British set up where they open homes on the weekends or summers which would help things turnaround. My first chateau I had been in was full of mice as well and it took the shine off rather immediately!!
DeleteThere are a few blogs about the whole second home in France thing - have you seen Chateau de Gudanes? They're Aussies I think, and it's so far the slowest renovation due to all the various layers of bureaucracy and heritage stuff they have to go through. They're on my blogroll…
ReplyDeleteBut yes, house prices are horrific in a lot of the world. I blame easily available credit. Back in the old days it was very difficult to get a loan, and they wouldn't loan much compared to your salary/ deposit etc. Now the banks practically throw millions at you, which fuels big house prices/ investments properties etc etc. At least that's my take on it in Australia. If credit were restricted house prices wouldn't be able to grow so much. We're constantly amazed by the junior staff in my husband's office buying property that is incredibly expensive as their first houses. A combination of not wanting to wait for the 'big' house (or compromise on location), and the easy credit they get means they are on a treadmill I wouldn't want to be on...
No one compromises anymore!! But that chateau is pretty much emblematic of the chateau dream. I sometimes read it but there are hardly any updates which is very telling!! They went in thinking they are doing the area a favour by investing in a neglected ruin but all they get is grilled with every step they make and I doubt they'd get their full money back if they tried to sell it now plus they'll have to wait years to do that even. At least in Australia you don't have to wait a year to sell a house and that's why it's so expensive BC it's a liquidity issue.
DeleteNo they don't compromise! When we're invited to their homes we are always gobsmacked at the furniture/ art etc that is more expensive than ours, and it's the running joke in his office that my husband drives the same car as one of the first year staffers. It's a perfectly nice car although older. But none of them compromise! No starter homes/ Ikea for them
DeleteYes, good observations about the Chatau. Initially they were saying they were going to live in it, now they seem less enchanted and are going to run it as a function centre / hotel I gather. It's kind of one of those grand designs shows that drags out over 5 years at this point!
Funny the chateau G updated this week saying they finally had wifi! Quite telling...there was a show on the BBC last night about spending and it was a shocker. It had spending habits of different people from different segments of society- was a corker!!
DeleteI love the idea of living abroad for 3 months of the year annually and therefore if there was an option to rent a French château for 3 months and leave all the maintenance issues to someone else, I'd take it although you'd feel obliged to always go there rather than anywhere else! The documentaries I've watched about buying and renovating abroad have made me a little nervous about even considering it! xx
ReplyDeleteYes I am thinking renting might be the way to go but ironically even though I don't like to vacation here they are the best investments! To have bought a cottage ten years ago in Cornwall...I think a balance is key and I'm still trying to figure it out.
DeleteOh my. Having lived in France for 14 years, I would just chime in that one would be really, really wise to have already spent extended periods of time in the country (not just blissful vacations) before buying or certainly launching into an extensive renovation project. There is SO much to be aware of beforehand. Unless, of course, money is not a big concern in which there are some rather amazing chateau's to be had even for a million Euros. Or Provençal farmhouses for half that. But certainly if someone is thinking of living in this country full-time...well, it is a far bigger change than "just across the pond" conjures up. I remember telling my Mom when I first moved to Paris from NYC that everything was so different that I had might as well moved to Vietnam! And yes, real-life continues...and with that I sign off to attack a huge pile of ironing that needs to be done...
ReplyDeleteInteresting point because I think many have that issue with the UK too. People think that it is so similar because they speak English here but that gives a false sense of similarity. At least with a foreign language there are clearer lines and less assumption. But there is something hypnotic about Provence and yet even in such a glorious place there are such mundane tasks that still need to be done ;)
DeleteUh, hello? Are you kidding me? Do you own that vintage VCA lion brooch? Here's another post request--time to write about it! I want to hear all the details of how it came to be in your possession! Another post you can dedicate to me! Ha ha. xx
ReplyDeleteI have a couple of pals with places in France but they are laid back and resilient people (I am not.) Oakville/Toronto has a similar housing market to Vancouver and it's depressing how little you get. Love that cartoon. How true!
ReplyDeleteThey must have resilience beyond belief!! Plus how do you manage the place from so far? Truth be told I would rather invest in your area economically because while the price rises aren't so drastic the prices fell in half during the crisis last decade. Isn't that cartoon so funny? How many people subliminally do that!
DeleteLoved reading this and anyone thinking of buying a place in France would be wise to read this first. The grass always seems greener on the other side and I can well understand the desire to pack it all in for a more beautiful and older place. However, the hidden costs of maintenance should send a shiver down every potential buyer's back. I recall reading A Year In Provence and learning about he laid back attitude of local tradesmen and the bureaucracy that accompanied getting things taken care of. A nightmare!
ReplyDeleteYes if you get the local council who are not on your side they can cause such grief as they can meddle with everything and raise flags and ask for applications...ironically the laid back attitude is what attracts you but then that is the very thing that can also drive you mad!!
DeleteAbsolutely great post, dear Naomi! I was wandering around the Dijon area in my younger days and even then in antiquity, chateau prices were extremely inviting (especially very dilapidated ones). So glad I resisted the temptation! Renting is definitely the way to satisfy those chateau fantasies! :-) Emily
ReplyDeleteI'm glad you did especially in Dijon! Otherwise you'd still be waiting for planning permission hehe
DeleteWouldn't it be wonderful I think as I sit in a Sydney flat worth a ridiculous amount of money mainly because of its location and off street parking. I'm not complaining but the cost of property is a major issue here.
ReplyDeleteAnyway thanks for explaining the reality of these gorgeous French piles which I'm sure are not easy to live in...but I'd like to try for a while. Actually just a thought, from Sydney I could investigate places in New Caledonia for sale, close to home and FRENCH!
At least you don't have to wait years if you ever wanted to sell up!
DeleteI say try renting but the New Caledonia idea is a great one too thinking about it - less jet lag.
I guess that's one thing we are spared here in California? We imagine places in Napa, nearby, or maybe Alaska if we are tired of the crowds:). No need to go all the way to France for sun and grapes. Great post, I had no idea moving to a chateau in France was such a shared dream!
ReplyDeleteYou get the best of both in Napa - better service and no language barriers!!
DeleteNaomi I know a school mate who just bought a country home in France. It looks like a lovely town, but I wonder how often can they enjoy it? Two times a year? France is a long flight from California. They also had a great article recently (forgot where now) about how much cheaper it is to rent a chateau in France vs. a week at Disneyworld!! I loved that. Why not visit the real thing instead of showing your kids the faux Europe of Epcot? xx Kim
ReplyDeleteI can't imagine how Californians do it because it's tough even from London. x
DeleteWe have a number of friends who have bought houses in France and after all the hard work as well as fun of getting them into a habitable state enthusiasm has waned with constant upkeep, travel and taxes. Every winter I am tempted by the idea of a place in the sun. We own a small bolt hole in North Yorkshire, a six hour journey from our home, and know just what is involved in maintaining even a tiny second home. Without a very hefty bank balance a French chateau could end up being a nightmare. (Rather a tempting thought, even so!)
ReplyDeleteThe makeover is the funnest bit. People who are into doing up houses are always going to be looking for the older uglier model!!
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